When I'm Paying You, Keep Your Views To Yourself

It's amazing how insulated one can be from personal experience of crazy wingnut views, even in Kansas.  Not that all my friends, relatives and acquaintances are progressives; far from it.  But I was surprised and more than a little dismayed when the hygienist at my dentist's office decided, while cleaning my teeth, to engage in a nonstop litany of crazy wingnut talking points.

- She asked me if I knew very much about the Roman empire, mentioning how she had read a book about Cicero which quoted him predicting the demise of the Roman Empire because the government had started "handing out freebies to everyone, just like with America now becoming socialist." 

- She lamented what has become of California, and professed great sympathy for "poor Arnold,' who probably wishes he had never run for governor. 

- She talked about Texas - and Montana, apparently? - passing resolutions asserting their sovereignty as states and how the federal government shouldn't be able to do anything not expressly spelled out in the Constitution.

- She discussed the people moving to New Hampshire to try and establish a place outside of federal control.

- She even talked about people moving to Costa Rica "to have more freedom."

All this while cleaning my teeth, people.  My wife was proud of me for not calling my dentist into the room to demand someone not brain-damaged by exposure to the toxic effects of right-wing "thought."

The Crazy Hygienist Lady obviously expected it to be a conversation, but rather than attempting to engage her directly, I just tried to chip away at the edges.  Things like pointing out that the Roman empire actually lasted until the fall of Constantinople in 1453, so Cicero was off by around 1,500 years in his prediction of the empire's demise, that Texas was using federal money to repair its own governor's mansion, so they can hardly be considered to be all that concerned about federal interference, etc.

It's one thing to read conservative blogs or hear pundit/entertainers like Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck spouting off nonsense.  It's quite another to run into someone who actually buys into all their bullshit.  No wonder it's so hard to make any progress in this country.  What should by rights be the realm of wild-eyed ranters on street corners has been mainstreamed and believed by large swaths of the population.

Comments

[litbrit]

Ugh, few things upset me more than hearing the words of someone I admire get used and twisted.

Not only was your tooth-lady off on the dates, she was off (completely off) on Cicero's philosophy and beliefs, too. What he actually said was that if the country did not remain faithful to its core values, it would disintegrate. So of course the wingnuts are going to gloss over the fact that Bush pretty much trashed all those core values like, oh, protection against illegal search and seizure, habeas corpus, and on and on...

Instead, they are positing (not that most of them would know the definition of "posit", but anyway) that the country has moved away from its core values of Every Man For Himself, and that's why the Republic will collapse.

Except, if we returned to the times of yore, the wealthy, along with corporate America, would actually be paying higher taxes, since Bush gave them all those upper-level tax cuts.

I think what they want to say is, It's not welfare if it benefits wealthy Wall Street dudes; it IS welfare when it helps poor people and children.

And the irony is, unless your dentist pays his hygienists more than my brother-in-law pays his, she's definitely *not* in that upper 5% income bracket, so none of the conservatard tax tangoing has helped her one bit.

The Republic may well fall, and if and when it does, it will not be due to taxation, health-care programs, or welfare, but rather, it will be because we abandoned core values like due process, innocent until proven guilty, one man-one vote, and of course, that all-important Cicero maxim:

Salus populi suprema est

"The well-being of the people is the supreme law."

[Sir Charles]

I feel fortunate -- I as at the dentist today and the hygienist just went on at length about her condo and neighborhood, which actually was kind of interesting since it was near a place I lived many years ago and was once quite scary by any standards.

I am just curious if any of these clowns could name one way in which their freedom has been inhibited since Obama got elected. Really -- even one small thing.

Oh maybe they feel less comfortable throwing the "n" word around. And they feel bad that there is a black president and he is so self-evidently better than they are in every way possible.

[Lisa]

The real question is why she thinks it's okay to be going on about her political beliefs in a professional setting. She's your hygienist, not your philosopher-queen.

Whatever happened to the rules of common courtesy, as in you don't discuss politics with strangers? And you certainly don't burden the open-mouthed, vulnerably positioned patient before you with your political spewings.

[konagod]

She probably thinks either:

a) proselytizing political beliefs is her Christian duty

b) She's right (because goddamn it, Fox says so!) and therefore only a fool would disagree.

[Stephen]

Yeah, I don't mind discussing politics usually, but it does change things a bit when I'm at the business end of those damn picks.

And konagod nailed it, except that it's most likely both a and b, not one or the other.

[kathy a.]

i just don't get why the big crazies get paid the big bucks to spout nonsense to millions. and sir charles has it right, not a one of their followers can really complain about obama wrecking their lives. but anyway...

the dental experience is just not a good place for deep discussions, seeing how it is hard to speak up when someone is sticking pointy things into one's gums and teeth and all. i haven't gotten this kind of political BS from hygenists, but the time that one opined that i had SKIN CANCER ON MY FACE, right when my dad was dying of metastatic skin cancer, and my face only had some normal pigmentation issues -- that was special. my heart was not broken when that person was not around for the next cleaning.

[John]

It's a small point, but Cicero couldn't have predicted the fall of the Roman Empire because he didn't live to see the Roman Empire. He lived during the Republic and was killed during the Second Triumvirate because of his opposition to Antony. The start of the empire is usually dated to when Octavian assumed sole rule.

Also, I hate it when dentists or hygienists ask me questions when they have their implements in my mouth! There's no easy way to respond.

[MR Bill]

General ignorance of history, particularly ancient history, is rampant. The idea of "Roman Decadence" is so fixed, the wingnutty types never notice the Mad Emperors were near the beginning of the Empire, when it was at it's strongest. (I happen to be rewatching a loaned copy of I, Claudius just now...)
And if you want to see some real wingnut head explosions, try telling them that Rome didn't fall (or at least wasn't sacked by barbarians) until it had been officially a 'Christian Nation', with all other religions suppressed, for over a hundred years. Or that it was sacked by a nominally Christian, Alaric the Goth.
I quit going to a particular barber because he would get to spouting a particular type of theology: if they start using the Scowfield chain reference Bible to 'prove' anything, run, don't walk away.

[litbrit]

Lord, the South is a strange, strange place some days, isn't it, MR Bill? Sometimes I can't quite believe the stuff that comes out of people's mouths. Sometimes you want an instant-replay so you can double check that what you heard was, indeed, what the person said.

It's also fun to be in line at the grocery store and hear a couple of Southern Wingnuts them talking about the global warming hoax; meanwhile, they're standing next to TIME and Newsweek magazine covers that sport photos of melting icebergs and big, scary headlines.

[Mudge]

A friend, well educated, started spouting over a beer about loss of freedom with Obama. I asked him politely to name one, or even a proposed loss. He had no response. End of conversation. With a dittohead, ask for specific examples or (2nd option) exaggerate right back..if you don't know about Cicero say "He was talking about the pernicious influence of Christianity destroying the empire." Maybe too strong for Stephen, but effective since they know not of that of which they speak. They almost always lack context.

[ballgame]

A friend, well educated, started spouting over a beer about loss of freedom with Obama. I asked him politely to name one, or even a proposed loss. He had no response.

If you're dealing with a dittohead, Mudge, I can see how that would work, but the reality is that Obama's record in preserving our freedoms has been, well, absolutely appalling.